"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
05/16/2019 at 17:17 • Filed to: None
0
35|
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
05/16/2019 at 17:17 • Filed to: None | 0
| 35 |
According to this, a Tesla driver gets in an accident only a quarter of the time compared with the average car/ driver (probably similar to other modern cars with advanced safety features), and when Autopilot is engaged, it’s even less likely to be in an accident by a factor of nearly two .
It can be argued that Autopilot is more likely to be used in situations where crashes are less likely: slow speed crawl, long & straight sections of highway, etc.
For Sweden
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 17:29 |
|
MCAS is also a safety feature, FYI. It’s still giving Boeing problems.
BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 17:33 |
|
I wish other automakers kept / released data regarding crashes and their various semi-autonomous cars. You never hear about crashes with Mercedes or Subaru in semi-autonomous mode, and it’s probable that there’s been one (several) .
facw
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 17:35 |
|
I think you are right that the big thing is that autopilot is mostly used in situations that are less likely to result in accidents (though the speeds involved may make fatal accidents more common). I haven’t seen a good analysis of how it compares just in those situations. I can believe that it is actually safer though. Sure it may do some absurdly stupid thing like miss a truck once in a while, but I’ve driven in Houston, and I can assure your there are human drivers doing absurdly stupid things pretty much constantly.
RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 17:36 |
|
Not to play Devil’s Advocate here, but keep in mind these are numbers coming from Tesla themselves, so I wouldn’t trust them 100%. Not saying they are fairly accurate...but keep in mind companies never want to release data that makes them look bad, eh?
ttyymmnn
> For Sweden
05/16/2019 at 17:37 |
|
To hear Muilenburg tell it, MCAS was never an anti-stall device.
|
davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
> BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind
05/16/2019 at 17:38 |
|
They’re clearly doing this to push back against all the press they’ve gotten for the few Autopilot deaths. It’s a smart marketing move, even if the implied safety of the system is not exactly accurate (same-to-same).
|
For Sweden
> ttyymmnn
05/16/2019 at 17:38 |
|
MCAS is a 737-NG emulator.
|
ttyymmnn
> For Sweden
05/16/2019 at 17:38 |
|
Also this .
|
For Sweden
> ttyymmnn
05/16/2019 at 17:39 |
|
oof
|
davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
> facw
05/16/2019 at 17:39 |
|
I mean, having a computer drive while a human is not driving is much safer than having nothing drive while that same human is not driving...
|
davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
> RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars
05/16/2019 at 17:42 |
|
Right. I don’t doubt the veracity of their numbers, but they clearly wouldn’t be releasing them if they didn’t look favorable, and they’re not about to mention the point that I did about Autopilot getting the “easy” stuff (little to no intersections, pulling out into traffic from a parking lot, etc.).
ShrimpHappens, née WJalopy
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 17:49 |
|
I can’t think of a better way for them to report the numbers—I assume it’s impossible to get individualized crash records for any other vehicle.
But with the technology involved , is it really a proper and fair comparison? In context, i sn’t it kind of like Benz bragging that his Patent-Motorwagen has a significantly lower rate of horse-related crashes?
fintail
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 18:14 |
|
This is from the same source that valued time spent at a gas station at $100/hour, claimed filling up took 15 minutes, and then calculated that into ownership costs, right?
Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 18:39 |
|
There’s also faaaaaaar less Tesla’s driving around with Autopilot on than any car without it. We’re talking fractions of a percent. Remember, you can statistically “prove” anything that you want to.
nermal
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 18:40 |
|
Looking at trends, it means that Teslas are getting more dangerous over time! Probably due to the average cost coming down, and more idiots being able to afford them.
I think it’s important to consider correlation vs causation as well. WHY are the numbers different?
Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 18:43 |
|
My thoughts are that every driver that died while autopilot was on seems to have NOT been paying attention like they were supposed to.
Thus it was Darwinism in action.
And in 2 cases, the real issues were truck drivers not yielding to the right of way as well as the trucking industry not having proper guards installed on trailers to prevent submarining.
LongbowMkII
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 18:49 |
|
Autopilot “ought” to only be engaged in perfect conditions so that’s really sad.
His Stigness
> fintail
05/16/2019 at 18:59 |
|
You have to be shitting me! They figured in refueling time as a cost of ownership?
gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
> His Stigness
05/16/2019 at 20:27 |
|
I think they had to stop a couple years ago.
But they still include fuel savings in their estiamted cost and have been called out
https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/7/18255252/tesla-german-regulators-drop-gas-savings-price
https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#battery
E92M3
> davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
05/16/2019 at 21:24 |
|
I heard on a local consumer advocate podcast, that insurers may b e getting ready to increase the rates on T eslas significantly , or stop issuing policies for them all toget her . He thinks Tesla might be getting ready to provide insurance coverage themselves to help combat the fear of being priced out of coverage or not being able to find reason able rates.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/16/2019 at 22:14 |
|
Yep. I can’t make that shit up.
|
davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
> E92M3
05/16/2019 at 23:22 |
|
I heard that Tesla was going to start offering insurance, but not why.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/17/2019 at 13:28 |
|
And people trust that wack job with their lives.
Wow.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/17/2019 at 13:33 |
|
It’s a shame, as the car is technically interesting and innovative, but the company operates with the trustworthiness of a typical MLM/Amway scheme, and its chief is a cult leader with no impulse control.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/17/2019 at 14:30 |
|
Yup. I was just talking to my brother in law who wants a Tesla because much of their engineering is brilliant, but I don’t think he can buy into the cult. And he’s also an incredibly smart engineer and savy investor so he sees the writing on the wall. I guess he is waiting on the VW SUV to come out before he makes a final decision on the Model Y. And I really hope the ID Big is good enough for him because I would honestly hate to see him get a Tesla. He’s too smart for that. He doesn’t need to buy into the hype.
|
His Stigness
> gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
05/17/2019 at 19:00 |
|
Holy fucking christ..
$5 a gallon.
15 miles per gallon.
$100 an hour.
And no taking into account charging at public stations which takes WAY longer than “15 minutes” filling up with gas.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/17/2019 at 22:59 |
|
I like the idea of an EV too, but I am patient enough to wait for tech to improve a bit, and for infrastructure to build out a bit more. By then I might be able to get a vehicle with the styling and interior quality afforded by an existing maker - I don’t love Tesla design, and the materials may be suited for a base 3, but not for anything above 50K. I also want maybe just a little more range and chargers - my building has none, and I don’t see any residents wanting to pay for it yet. It might be a good 5-10 years off for me.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/18/2019 at 13:59 |
|
It’s rapidly expanding that I think in just a few years, that people such as yourself who can afford a new E Class will be able to get a good EV should they want one.
I just test drove the Audi e tron yesterday, and HOLY SHIT, I think it’s perfect. The range leaves a little bit to be desired. Stated range is 205, but I asked them what the real world mileage was and I think you can comfortably figure 250 for you or me. If you live where it snows a good portion of the year then 205 will be your realistic range.
But other than the range, it really is perfect. For about $85,000 configured it is WAY nicer than a Q5 or Q8. The new MMI is an utter joy to use. Audi has come up with some new haptic feedback to where it feels like you pressed a real button. It was hard for me to not drool. And then driving it was just a normal car, and because the battery is on the floor it felt like driving my e-Golf, I was just sitting ever so slightly higher.
If I had a garage big enough, I really think I would get one. I still can’t get over how great it is.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/18/2019 at 23:57 |
|
I could probably afford a loaded 3 or a lightly used S or X, but so far, it’s a hard no. I am not won by the design (I actually think the 3 wears the theme best), and I just need more range and infrastructure. I can’t charge at home, and I go on a few long roadtrips to BFE every year. I don’t want to stop for an hour on a 350 mile drive, and I don’t want to have to worry about finding a place to charge in a small town where an EV will be seen as a spaceship. I think in 5-10 years, some of this may be in the past.
I wonder if we will have swappable batteries - it seems like a huge thing to build out, but it would save a lot of time. The charging time really gets me, as when I am on the road, I like to keep moving. For a commuter, it would be brilliant if I could charge at home. But on trips, not yet.
I hope MB can develop something like that Audi, sounds impressive. That’s another wish I know won’ t come true - I want it to look like a normal car. I don’t need virtue signaling or showing off.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/19/2019 at 00:58 |
|
I think it will only take a few years to get really fast charging and normal looking cars. Or maybe three-five years at most. They Taycan will look the most normal, and the charging architecture for that is nuts. I think it will be able to do 90 miles or five minutes. So in another generation, it should be able to approach gas refueling times.
I think the e-tron already looks normal, and so does the EQC. The Teslas don’t, and eventually, they will run out of nerds to sell their cars to, and the Germans will be there to swipe up buyers who want a normal looking car, lke you and I. I don’t like the flashy looks either, that’s why I got an e-Golf.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/19/2019 at 14:09 |
|
This is what I’d want: Give me an E-class. Totally stock looks, maybe not even any special badging. Put the EV powertrain in it. Done. Normal car with new efficiency. Sometimes I wonder if we could have better results if the resources used to design new platforms and bodies for this tech wasn’t used on the tech itself.
The Tesla/nerd thing is definitely real in the Seattle area, and I suspect Silicon Valley and LA, too. These are Prius people with more money.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/19/2019 at 14:47 |
|
I think now that lessons have been learned with cars like the i3 and i8, manufacturers are going to make normal cars, but they just don't have a regular engine. VW was pretty damn quick with MEB platform, and that will pay off in the long run as they can churn out all sorts of cars quickly like the E tron, the ID 3, and whatever else they come up with. And they look normal! Shit, even the E tron can be bad with totally normal wheels.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/19/2019 at 22:45 |
|
I think there’s an executive debate - make it different or make it discreet. Maybe they should do both - some want to show off that they drive an EV. I am not in that target market. I consider myself relatively liberal from a socio-political view, but when it comes to cars, I am fairly traditionalist.
I have to believe the Germans have a lot up their sleeves - they aren’t going to roll over and cede the premium market to Tesla or similar.
|
His Stigness
> fintail
05/20/2019 at 01:40 |
|
If we can get it down to just wheels being the only place you can tell someone is driving an EV, I’d be happy with that. But, I’m like you, I’m liberal, but I don’t want my car to broadcast what party I may vote for.
I think VW does, at least. Mercedes seems to have phoned it in with the EQC just being a GLE with a battery, just like the e-Golf was. Unless that’s a stop-gap measure and they’re hard at work at a new platform just like VW already developed. I still think it’s insane VW already came out with the MEB. But, I have a feeling that’s more a testament to just how ingenious MQB and the other platforms are.
|
fintail
> His Stigness
05/20/2019 at 13:31 |
|
Oh yeah, I also don’t want another generic cloned CUV. I hope there’s a normal car on its way.